To know that the international standard, to implement the international standard is very important for people who are in a jail – in detention. Okay, because it is something which is written by the United Nations, approved by the (______), ratified by many countries among them Rwanda. And when, when we went there during – when I was working there from October ‘94 to ‘98, it was not easy at the beginning.
Even to visit the, the, the prisons it was difficult. Slowly they agreed that you can visit but you have to be very, very – what they say – firm. And later on when we went to, for negotiation of agreement, it was not easy regarding facilities we want them to, to have if they are maybe one day transferred there. Like to have to be in touch with the family is very important, to have a visit is very important.
Later on when even when we, we implemented the conjugal visit the Minister of Justice of Rwanda reacted very, very, very strongly. Those kind of things I think – (___) we say, “No, you have to go, you cannot . . .” The husbands are in detention, okay, but why to, to, what they say, the family members have to suffer, the wife? It is the kind of thing which can maintain I think the contact of, consolidate the, the, the unity of, the union of the family. But if there’s nothing and after ten years it’s not easy.